NPR’s Michel Martin speaks with Republican Rep. Brian Fitzpatrick of Pennsylvania and Democratic Rep. Tom Suozzi of New York about possible solutions to the partial government shutdown.
MICHEL MARTIN, HOST:
We’ve been checking in regularly with the leaders of the Problem Solvers Caucus. That’s a bipartisan group in Congress that tries to figure out how to make policy out of positions they think most Americans share. They think they have a compromise to end the partial government shutdown. It’s still a work in progress, but they want to extend funding for every agency in the Department of Homeland Security, except ICE.
It would condition ICE funding on reforms such as no masks on ICE officers and stronger warrant requirements to enter sensitive places, like hospitals and houses of worship. It would also include enhanced penalties for doxing, stalking or threatening the people who work for ICE and their families. The Problem Solvers Caucus is chaired by Democrat Tom Suozzi of New York and Republican Brian Fitzpatrick of Pennsylvania.
BRIAN FITZPATRICK: We are trying to find that common ground in the center and be the adults in the room.
MARTIN: The proposal that you’re making would include full funding of TSA and FEMA, all these other agencies that are now affected by this partial government shutdown. Coupled with that, you would have some reforms to the way ICE operates. The question I have is, what’s the leverage? Because ICE is already being funded. These other entities are not.
THOMAS SUOZZI: Right now, ICE is operating unimpeded. All these other Department of Homeland Security officers, the TSA guys are not getting their paychecks, the Coast Guard’s not getting their paychecks, etc. etc. ICE is getting their paychecks because when they did what’s called the Big Beautiful Bill, they funded ICE with $75 billion. So the leverage that exists right now is just that the people are, like, what’s wrong with you guys? Why do you letting this go on and on for? And the people are looking at the lines at the airport and they’re looking at what’s going on with the bad behavior of ICE, and they’re saying, can’t you guys just fix this?
MARTIN: So Representative DeLauro, Democrat, has a discharge petition that would do some of the things that your proposal says, fund a number of DHS agencies, including FEMA and TSA. Now, a discharge petition, that’s the process that compelled the release of the Epstein files. Mr. Suozzi, you are co-sponsoring this at this moment. Mr. Fitzpatrick, you’re not. Any reason why not?
FITZPATRICK: You mean sign the discharge?
MARTIN: Yeah. Sign the discharge.
FITZPATRICK: I absolutely would, if it were just ICE.
MARTIN: If it were just ICE.
FITZPATRICK: The problem is, there’s CBP in there. So I told our Democrat colleagues that I would absolutely sign it. In fact, was planning on signing it until I was told, as I was approaching the desk to sign it, that it included cutting off CBP funding. That is very, very dangerous. They stop fentanyl at the airports. They stop a whole lot of dangerous things from coming through our airports. Why include them in that? It didn’t make any sense.
MARTIN: We’ve had several conversations with the two of you, and the ongoing theme is, this is where you think most people actually are. You think most of your constituents – this is where they actually are. They want to see negotiated solutions to complicated problems. And you’ve also made the argument that this is where your colleagues actually are.
SUOZZI: Some of our colleagues.
MARTIN: Well, to that point, though, the Cook Political Report says that there are only 36 of 435 House seats that are competitive, maybe 17 are toss-ups. If you add in all of the seats that are even considered nominally competitive, that’s only a fraction of the members of the House. So I guess the question is what you two are doing. Is it mainly a thought exercise or is it mainly to role model what it could be like, or do you really feel that you can have an influence on how these issues get worked out?
SUOZZI: I think it’s all three of those things. I mean, most of the seats in Congress are safe seats. You cannot lose. The Republicans are going to win the Republican seat, the Democrats are going to win the Democratic seat. When you’re in a seat that you can’t lose, you don’t listen to the people. You don’t have to listen to the people. So the Republicans pandered to their base in the safe seats, and the Democrats pandered to their base in the safe seats.
Brian and I have to listen to everybody. If I just listen to the Democrats and go along with everything the Democrats want, I’m going to lose. I’ve had to listen to the independents and I have to listen to some of the Republicans as well ’cause that is what the people want. In all the districts, even in the safe seats, the problem is the people don’t have as much influence because they’re safe seats.
MARTIN: Mr. Fitzpatrick, do you actually think you’re going to have an influence on the outcome of these issues?
FITZPATRICK: One hundred percent. There’s a two-seat majority in U.S. House and a three-seat majority in the Senate. So, under that viewpoint, he and I can have a huge impact, and we have.
MARTIN: From the Democratic perspective, are you concerned at some point that it becomes – you know, the president is very good at memeifying issues, reducing them to its kind of simplest arguments.
SUOZZI: There’s no question that the…
MARTIN: Are you concerned at any point that the president starts to say that the argument becomes that the Democrats are not paying the TSA workers so that they can protect illegal immigrants?
SUOZZI: He’s obviously saying things like that already. The president’s great at distracting people from the issues that are going on right now. But we just saw the Senate, Democrats and Republicans are saying, we got a deal. We can figure out how to fund DHS and move forward. And the president says, I don’t want to do a deal. The president said, no, no, no. Don’t make a deal with the Democrats. I mean, that’s just bad. That’s bad for our country. I mean, the guy is not negotiating.
I mean, one of the things that baffles me is he does these press conferences with Zohran Mamdani, the mayor of New York City, and says, oh, he’s a good guy, like, you know, we’re going to try and work together on things. Now, why is he talking to Zohran Mamdani who he said he doesn’t like him, he’s a communist, you know, he’s no good? But he won’t even talk to the Democrats in Congress at all. I mean, there’s been simply no negotiations.
MARTIN: Before we let you go, I’d like to ask each of you – forgive me if it’s not a fair question, but how optimistic are you that you can achieve a negotiated agreement about this funding for DHS?
FITZPATRICK: Very optimistic because it has to happen. It has to happen. Think of the alternative. If we don’t fund them, then what, right? God forbid a disaster strikes, whether it be at an airport or a natural disaster, that there is not funding and/or personnel to protect us from. That’s catastrophic. And, you know, we have a lot of things that are broken about our government. It’s hard to get things done in this country.
But with tight margins and a very, very frustrated public, Tom and I feel very confident that our views reflect the views of most Americans. I think that’s why there’s such a cavernous disconnect between the public and the institutions that represent them because the institutions are not making decisions in the same form and fashion that families are. They don’t always agree, but they don’t say, well, if you don’t agree with me, you’re a stupid or a bad person, and I’m going to take my marbles and go home. And yet, so many people here operate like that.
MARTIN: Mr. Suozzi, what about you?
SUOZZI: If you want the governing bodies to do things that the people want in a democracy, the people have to be involved. So I’m hopeful that the people are getting more and more frustrated and that will force them to get more involved in taking control of their democracy. I know that what we’re working on right now, to reopen the DHS, to put reforms in place for ICE, is what the people want. That’s what the people want. So we’re just trying to give the people what they want that we know is the right thing.
MARTIN: Mr. Suozzi, Mr. Fitzpatrick, thank you both so much…
FITZPATRICK: Thank you.
MARTIN: …For talking to us.
SUOZZI: Thank you so much.
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